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    ^this totally works, I can find at least 30 late-night TV primary sources to back it up.

    What I've been told by coaches/PT people (for rugby, but can be more widely applicable) is dynamic stretching before, static stretching after. I don't have any studies offhand to support this, just anecdotal evidence. Besides, dynamic stretching before cycling seems kind of silly.DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    i prefer silicon injections straight to the balls, thank you very much.
    i thought the only real way was to inject ones own fat into the shaft, but that was more girth than length related
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    I seriously don't know if stretching is good for you or not. I know that it feels good, but I do a bunch of stuff that feels good that isn't necessarily good for me. I'm pretty sure we're discussing a knee/joint injury here.

    I would bet that doing your PT, which strengthens the muscles around your sciatic nerves, is what relieves the pain from that injury.

    I'm not a Dr. just refuting the premise that stretching is going to cure this guy's joint pain.

    Here's an interesting statement from this site

    One study found stretching was associated with less groin/buttock problems in cyclists, but only in women. Five studies suggesting no difference in injury rates between stretchers and non-stretchers and three suggesting stretching was detrimental. One reason stretching is thought to be ineffective in reducing the risk of injury is the fact that most muscle injuries occur when the muscle is eccentrically contracted within the normal range of motion (Shrier 1999). It seems more flexible individuals do not necessarily have less incidence of injury (Gleim 1997). In some cases those with greater flexibility may actually experience more injury, particularly if the excessive flexibility compromises joint integrity (Surberg 1983; Jones 1997).

    How about this one:

    You may think that stretching after you run seems like an obvious good choice. Think again. You are already warmed up, but now your muscles are pumping and it takes them awhile to adjust to the fact that you've stopped running. To force them into an opposite action, like stretching, immediately after you stop running can cause them to actually constrict more in an effort to "save themselves". If you do choose to stretch after you run, you should wait 30-45 minutes after you stop running to do so.

    So I'm saying we don't know. I mean you are pointing to studies with this conclusion:

    Conclusion: Stretching before and after physical activity does not appreciably reduce all-injury risk, but probably reduces the risk of some injuries, and does reduce the risk of bothersome soreness.

    I'm not entirely convinced.We are the small axe.
    mouse:maybe you can stretch your peen to make it longer

    wont that make it skinnier as well?YO NOT EVERYBODY GOES TO EAR SCHOOL OK
    tone, i think part of the issue we are having is defining injury. i wouldnt think stretching would reduce the risk of joint injury, what is a joint injury by the way?YO NOT EVERYBODY GOES TO EAR SCHOOL OK
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    It's when you roll a joint to tight and can't get any draw out of it.We are the small axe.
    isnt that what a vaporizer is for?YO NOT EVERYBODY GOES TO EAR SCHOOL OK
      CommentAuthorpaul jameson
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011 edited
    ^^^^^^chicken fat works, too.You said time was infinite, so why the watch wrapped around your wrist?
    Then you inject fat back in for girth!DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    Yes, I'm sure a vaporizer would cure any joint injuries. Where is the medical marijuana for this state anyways?

    Mouse: go get a fit and do a vape, you'll be fine.We are the small axe.
    i got THC pills when i had the cancer but they made me feel TERRIBLE. i wish i had friends with good weed back then, but alas, i was young, dumb, and full of cancer.YO NOT EVERYBODY GOES TO EAR SCHOOL OK
      CommentAuthorStinky Cheez
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011 edited
    There are many reasons to dislike it, but in some ways it's a shame they can't prescribe Sativex in this country (inhaler). On the otherhand, if the government would just stop being stupid and...

    But then, they do excel at being stupid. It's good to be good at something.

    edit: apparently Sativex is undergoing late stage FDA testing and should be available in the future.
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    With regard to stretching, I was definitely advised by a very reputable sports medicine doctor that stretching would help my knee pain. The reason: overdevelopment of the quad caused it to shorten, which in turn pulled on the knee. Stretching the quad lengthened it again, which relieved the pressure at the knee. Or something. In short, it's all connected.Worstcase I'll just zip tie on a seat... but i'd rather not. —Zev (who else)
    • CommentAuthormouse
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011 edited
    ^^^^ haha words of wisdom noted, thanks tonedon't take your back or ass off the ground, don't force it, and go real slow.
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    i had a lot of knee pain a few winters ago in the same place you described
    turns out it wasn't my bike
    i had a "couch" that was a futon mattress on the floor, so i sat indian style A LOT and it strained my knees i guess
    it would hurt when i sat indian style, which was always after riding my biek (if i'm home, i rode my bike to get there) so i thought it was my bike and not sitting in a stupid position for hours
    in conclusion furniture is a thing for a reason and keep an open mind, mouseMust be awful, being so fluffy.
    ^^same thing with plantar faschitis. stretch the tendon in the morning, relieve the pain caused by tightening overnightsomebody turn the lights off on this place already.
    • CommentAuthormouse
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011 edited
    ^^ right, right. but since its a pain ive had for so long ive been able to rule out just about everything else i could think of, except riding. i.e., i dont even get it during or after an hour on the treadmill or spin bike. very strange.

    ^im totally listening to all the stretching input here. im going to try stretching not only if and when i ride, but every morning and night anyway. and check out those links tone posted.

    im also borrowing a friend's IRO for a few days, see how that works out for me ::fingers crossed::don't take your back or ass off the ground, don't force it, and go real slow.
      CommentAuthorDan Roch
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011 edited
    I'd ride a freewheel for sometime. I have not so good knees and the eventual stress pain from riding a fixed gear got to me. I haven't ridden fixed in 2 years, Now they never hurt when riding. Saddle height is a big factor as well.Everybody was saying we must have more leisure. Now they are complaning they are unemployed - Prince Philip during the recession in 1981
    Yo mouse, I know I'm late to the party, but you probably have tendinitis. I got it in. November last year, it blows. Go easy on the biking, do wall sits to exercise the muscles, and wear looser pants. It sounds silly but it reduces pressure on your kneecap. You can also get a neoprene knee brace, one with the hole in it for your kneecap. That will keep it warm, and keep everything in place.Naaaah, too uncool for the #messlyfe. I just like to hang out in loading docks and pretend to talk on my radio so that people will like me. - Mfratt
    • CommentAuthormouse
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    ^ is that right? ill have to look it up. what was the pain like for you?

    yeah ive been doing the leggings thing and it gives me a bit less pain, and i thought about the knee brace but wasnt sure if i had to spend the money or not, ok wall sits, got it. thanks bud.don't take your back or ass off the ground, don't force it, and go real slow.
    • CommentAuthorunit
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    old mechanic's trick... spray some wd40 on a rag then rub your knees with it. Works every time.
    It was the worst pain I ever experienced,save having the morphine wear off after having a bone pinned. I dealt with it getting worse and worse for three days before I literally thought my knee was gonna shred. Went to the doctor and they took mri's and showed me how swollen and inflamed my connective tissue was. Get the bike fitted, and just go to city sports for the knee brace. They're like ten bucks if I remember correctly.Naaaah, too uncool for the #messlyfe. I just like to hang out in loading docks and pretend to talk on my radio so that people will like me. - Mfratt
    • CommentAuthormouse
    • CommentTimeApr 13th 2011
    awesome. so much help.

    does anyone have a recommendation as to where the best place to be fitted would be?don't take your back or ass off the ground, don't force it, and go real slow.
    Alexi (un: horsa hears a hengst) fit me. I don't recommend landrys as their fitting dude took 3 weeks to return my email.Naaaah, too uncool for the #messlyfe. I just like to hang out in loading docks and pretend to talk on my radio so that people will like me. - Mfratt
    Somewhere with lasers.DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    ^lasers are only as good as the person aiming them. Don't believe the hype!Is everyting irie?
    but, but but....lasers! i mean...LASERS!

    bikeguyboston:^lasers are only as good as the person aiming them. Don't, don't, don't don't don't believe the hype!
    DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    Basically, this is what you want:
    DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    okay, fine
    DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    • CommentTimeApr 14th 2011
    Craiginpictures:I don't recommend landrys as their fitting dude took 3 weeks to return my email.

    Lately, Landry's has been spot on with e-mail/phone call fit returns. Depending on when you e-mailed, we may have been in transition between fitters. Now, Grady is the head fitter over here and he's killing it. We may have been delayed also due to the amount of fits we've been doing lately. Feel free to call, it's faster, and we can book a fit as quick as the schedule allows. Keep in mind we need a deposit on any fitting service to reserve a time.Except our own thoughts, there is nothing absolutely in our power.
    I've always been into the Sheldon method of saddle height adjustment; raise the seat until you start rocking your hips to hit full extension, then go down little by little until you hit that perfect height for max leg extension.

    I usually plop my saddle right in the middle of the rails and might slide it back and forth slightly depending on how much offset is on the post, but generally I've never experienced any sort of pain or issues. I do this one a lot by feeling on how comfortable I am slamming down the pedals, like if I'm too far forward, I always want to set it back. If you're all the way slammed forward or back you probably need a different style of seat post.

    Stem height/angle/length is one of those personal things that you have to try out for yourself and sometimes can conflict with your choice of bars depending on the reach.

    Veering off topic on road bike fit: A -17° stem is going to be longer than a -6° stem for example, which is longer than a +6 rise, and so on and so forth (simple geometry). General rule of thumb for performance road cycling is that you don't really want to go much below 100 mm for a normal set of drops, although shorties on stuff like 53 and below can get away with a few cm shorter stems. If y'all need a 70mm stem, the bike is too big in the first place. On the other hand, I'm from the school of thought also that a stem can't be too long if it's comfortable if you feel like sizing down a frame, pro style (if you have the lower back flexibility for it). 140mm? Sure, why not.

    One should pretty much be able to sit all day long in the drops, which requires some finagling with stem stack height, stem angle, and length.

    Note that this only really applies to road bikes and traditional drops rather than mountain bikes with risers or downhill stuff, which is its own realm of stuff I will readily admit to knowing jack and shit about.

    I'd rather listen to what my own body or power meter has to say about fit on my bike more than lasers... Unless I'm jamming myself into a windtunnel for a TT position I have to learn to like.But the fact of the matter is: Bones heal. Chicks dig scars. And the United States of America has the best doctor-to-daredevil ratio in the world!
    • CommentTimeApr 14th 2011
    @surprisefries: i should hire you to do the album artwork for my next mixtape.
    • CommentTimeApr 14th 2011
    surprisefries:Basically, this is what you want:

    AMust be awful, being so fluffy.
    ^^yes.DFL and DTF :D:D:D:D
    your computer skills amaze me! i bow down. ^YO NOT EVERYBODY GOES TO EAR SCHOOL OK
    • CommentAuthorgemathy
    • CommentTimeApr 14th 2011
    1. when you have pain, don't ride.
    2. go to a doctor + get physical therapy.

    • CommentTimeApr 15th 2011
    I'm so sad I missed this thread until now, but I'm also happy to read it all at once. Good work, y'all.
    (Also, truffs: You made it back into my sig.)We'll get you a cat, don't worry -t-honks